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RE: TV-OUT on laptop causes major damage, fire / shock
by Brian Densmore 06 Dec '04

06 Dec '04

> -----Original Message----- > From: Duane Attaway > > OK, I recreated the laptop video out to television experiment. Dude! You are seriously twisted. ;') > > The first video was connecting the RCA cable to house > current. It was > uneventful and promptly blew the 20A house breaker each time. So I > started up the generator and was able to use unfused power. > > Here is a frame by frame of the video of the outer (ground) > conductor of > the video cable melting under 120 volts at 7500 VA: > > http://dattaway.org/whitewire.jpg > > Closeup of melted RCA cable: > > http://dattaway.org/whitewire2.jpg > > Other side: > > http://dattaway.org/whitewire3.jpg > > It took about two seconds of short current to melt the wire > and break the > circuit. It flashed when it broke. > > So what does that mean? It takes a lot of current from a 120 > volt feed to > blow the tiny stranded wires of a RCA video cable. I believe > each one of > the copper strands alone, seperated in air, should take 5 > amps each. I > counted 15 strands. > > Could a capacitor do it as someone suggested? Well it could, > but it would > have to be instantaneous. I have some capacitors up to 8KV > if you want to > see more video and pictures. Well it depends on the type of capacitor. It would have to be a polarized capacitor. I remember when I used to test power supplies for a company I worked at. We would buy them for our products, but they needed to be tested before being installed in our equipment. Every once in a while a PS would have the capacitor in reverse polarity. Quite a show when a big capacitor blows. Less frequently the capacitor would take too much voltage with the same end result, explosion. why do you say it would have to be instantaneous? Although from the description of the event it was instantaneous. > > I'd say his power supply had a minor meltdown inside, causing > the AC to > couple with the DC side. This allowed current to flow from > the AC mains, > through his laptop, and return through the television back > into the wall. > Televisions are designed with a neutral grounded chassis and > this may have > allowed a possibly defective power supply to complete a current loop. I'd tend to agree he's got a current/voltage leak in the PS, which of course could lead to a capacitor explosion. Haven't heard whether the laptop is usable now or if the adaptor is usable. If a cap went the PC or adaptor wouldn't work anymore. He's lucky the TV still works.

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Re: X terminal distributions?
by Brian Kelsay 06 Dec '04

06 Dec '04

I forgot to mention the venerable MuLinux. I used to dabble with it on an old machine. It's floppy based too and very feature rich. It was out there back in 98 when I started. It still uses the 2.0.x series of kernels, so it's not up to date by any means. For an old laptop or desktop it's not too bad though. VNC is on one of the disks you can build. That's how I found out about that fine tool ages ago. Check it out. http://mulinux.sunsite.dk/ Brian Kelsay

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RE: TV-OUT on laptop causes major damage, fire / shock
by Brian Densmore 04 Dec '04

04 Dec '04

I suspect that the guts of the Inspiron 8xxx adaptors is quite the same. With perhaps minor variations for connectors. The reason being to be able to "lock-in" users to a proprietary adaptor. Much like what vendors have done with batteries. I could be wrong, it might be that each laptop has different power needs, still they could have generalized the adaptors. Just because one model is being recalled doesn't mean that other models aren't also having problems. It's generally "cheaper", to face the lawsuits than it is to fix a component with a faulty design, from a purely actuarial point of view. Brian Densmore > -----Original Message----- > From: Thomas Bruno > > Only certain ac adaptors are sold with specific dell models. There is > only 1 kind of Inspiron 8500 AC, and only 1 kind of Inspiron 8200 > adaptor, the 8100 adaptor is on recall > > On Fri, 2004-12-03 at 10:13 -0600, djgoku wrote: > > That is really weird, but why would your model of laptop > matter it is > > the ac adaptor not that laptop on the recall. Hope you figure out > > what went wrong and the problem is fixed. > > > > > > On Fri, 03 Dec 2004 10:02:50 -0600, Thomas Bruno > <crweb(a)vwords.com> wrote: > > > > > > Bad part of the ac adaptor recall is, my system is one of > the very few > > > systems that the recall does not cover... wierd eh? > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, 2004-12-03 at 09:19 -0600, Keith Savasten wrote: > > > > > > > > > I'm still in a state of panic/shock as to what just > happened. I > > > > >will be researching legal options now, as my laptop > warranty ended > > > > >because the dell wouldn't let me renew because of a > mix up, and other > > > > >things that have built up (like sending it in for fan > swap to have it > > > > >come back not even turning it on), now this.. a > laptop I'm totally > > > > >terrified of even turning on. > > > > > > > > > > > > I wonder why DELL is recalling 4.5 million power > adaptors that "may > > > > overheat causing fire or electrical shock". That is an > awful lot of units to > > > > replace with only seven incidents reported to them. > > > > > > > > Keith Savasten > > > > > > > > Consumer Product Safety Commission > > > > > > > > http://www.cpsc.gov/cpscpub/prerel/prhtml05/05004.html > > > > > > > > The dell recall website: > > > > > > > > https://www.delladapterprogram.com/Main.aspx > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Kclug mailing list > > > Kclug(a)kclug.org > > > http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Kclug mailing list > Kclug(a)kclug.org > http://kclug.org/mailman/listinfo/kclug >

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TV-OUT on laptop causes major damage, fire / shock
by Thomas Bruno 03 Dec '04

03 Dec '04

Tonight, at roughly 10:30pm 12/02/04 I proceeded to plug my tvout adapter into my laptop to watch a dvd on my tv. I had just been a video from the cam corder, so the tv ports were ok and so was the rca cable. When I plugged it in, all I saw was a white flash. 3 of my friends in the room say that the RCA cable melted, the tv smoked inside with lots of white flashing inside of it, and the RCA cable was blown out of the laptop TV-OUT connector. I with a numb arm, awoke laying on the floor. Looking at the rca cable, I see bare wire sticking out of where it melted about 2 inches melted at each end. I'm still in a state of panic/shock as to what just happened. I will be researching legal options now, as my laptop warranty ended because the dell wouldn't let me renew because of a mix up, and other things that have built up (like sending it in for fan swap to have it come back not even turning it on), now this.. a laptop I'm totally terrified of even turning on. Update to the little story, I got a junk VCR that I have, and tried to plug the RCA tv out into it. it also proceeded to fry the vcr, and new rca cable. This is a problem with the laptop. The thing has worked with the same tv in the past, only thing different is that the laptop and tv were plugged into the same powerstrip this time. Anyone have any recommendations/experiences?

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Re: X terminal distributions?
by Brian Kelsay 03 Dec '04

03 Dec '04

It may have something to do with the inaccuracy of the older read heads on those CD drives. As for not being able to boot to CD, there was a point where the architecture changed within the PC. I recall in my first Pentium, the CD drive IDE cable plugged directly into the sound card. After most of the parts had been replaced in that PC I had plugged the replacement CD into the mobo and the drive worked better, however it still needed a boot floppy. Brian Kelsay >>> Leo Mauler <webgiant(a)yahoo.com> 12/03/04 12:45AM >>> --- Brian Kelsay <Brian.Kelsay(a)kcc.usda.gov> wrote: > Correct. And some old CD-ROM drives won't boot to > CD. YMMV. You can still do a boot from floppy and > hand off to CD. True enough. In the laptops I've tried which didn't boot from CD, miniCDs continued not to work even when booting from floppy first.

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RE: TV-OUT on laptop causes major damage, fire / shock
by Brian Densmore 03 Dec '04

03 Dec '04

Dude! You're getting Electrifi... err ... A Dell! > -----Original Message----- > From: Duane Attaway > > > > I wonder why DELL is recalling 4.5 million power adaptors that > > "may overheat causing fire or electrical shock". That is an > awful lot of > > units to replace with only seven incidents reported to them. > > That's the ticket right there! Something overheated and caused the > isolation from the mains to short to the DC side. That's > your fire and > electrical shock. > > ...

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Re: TV-OUT on laptop causes major damage, fire / shock
by Brian Kelsay 03 Dec '04

03 Dec '04

So does the TV work at all now? Did you go to the hospital? You should just to document the accident if you intend to sue somebody. Brian Kelsay >>> Thomas Bruno <crweb(a)vwords.com> 12/03/04 07:51AM >>> I thought I might now also add: I can still plug my old Nintendo into the TV's aux jacks, and everything be ok, no explosions or anything, in fact, I get a very distorted image, and loud screeching sound. All 3 aux line/channels display the same images. meaning aux channel 3, displays the same thing aux channel 1 displays even though it's plugged into aux 2. So it's obviously not the tv's fault.

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Re: X terminal distributions?
by Brian Kelsay 03 Dec '04

03 Dec '04

Looks like with using Small Linux you need 4MB for an X Windows system. It's going to be pretty basic. (More inline.) Brian Kelsay >>> Leo Mauler <> 12/02/04 09:53AM >>> >I just wanted to mention that a lot of older CD-ROM >drives don't like miniCDs and business card sized CDs >(or at least don't seem to boot from them). So even >though DamnSmallLinux does fit on a miniCD, go ahead >and burn it on a full-sized CD for those older laptops >that still have CDs. Correct. And some old CD-ROM drives won't boot to CD. YMMV. You can still do a boot from floppy and hand off to CD. The full-size CDs have a greater chance of working in the old drives and burn to CDR not RW at 4x or under. Again, YMMV, but this is from my experience. >From: Jonathan Hutchins <> >Date: 12/2/04 10:14AM >The problem I've encountered with this idea is that Xwindows itself is pretty >resource intensive, and many of the older systems have video cards that don't >have Linux drivers. At best, you may get 640x480x16 colors. You can >off-load most of the work to the server (talk to the Lumensoft guys), but you >still have to get a basic Xwindows setup going. 4M of RAM is going to be a >distinct challenge. On the Linux driver issue, most will work with a basic vesa driver, even the old ones. There are a very small number that don't. http://www.pps.jussieu.fr/~jch/software/kdrive.html The KDrive Tiny X Server Kdrive is used on DamnSmall Linux. http://www.linuxdevices.com/links/LK6129039469.html Short Tiny X article on embedded hardware. "Typical X servers based on Tiny-X can fit in less than 1MB on x86 CPUs." A 386 Twinhead laptop with 4MB RAM, 81MB hard drive: http://www.superant.com/cgi-bin/smalllinux.pl?Small_Linux_Notes_By_Levi_Wal… http://www.superant.com/cgi-bin/smalllinux.pl?SmallX FAQ and Howto >From: Gerald Combs >Date: 12/2/04 10:26AM >Are there any VNC clients that can use the console directly? If so, you >could run your X11 server remotely. If you have an LTSP setup, you are using remote X. From that you can run some form of VNC, like Xvnc. Without a full LTSP server setup you can do this manually. Set your machine with X running to enable XDMCP. http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/XDMCP-HOWTO/ Their example starts X on connection via shell or ssh http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/mini/XDM-Xterm/ http://www.linuxjournal.com/article.php?sid=6713 http://probing.csx.cam..ac.uk/about/xdmcp.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XDMCP http://x.cygwin.com/docs/ug/using-remote-session.html http://www.linuxgazette.com/issue27/kaszeta.html a decent example http://www.superant.com/cgi-bin/smalllinux.pl?Remote_X_Display Connect to the server from the console of the old PC. If you have your session automated, then X will just auto start your session when you login. Other wise you will need to run "X --query <ip address or hostname>" to get a specific server or "X --broadcast" to connect to any listening Xserver. Then run whatever VNC program is on the PC hosting the Xserver.

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X terminal distributions?
by Duane Attaway 03 Dec '04

03 Dec '04

I have several old laptops that could live a good life of xterminals. Unfortunately, some don't have hard drives, most have memory less than 64MB, and one is a 486 with 4MB. All can use a pcmcia ethernet card. What do most people do with these? Are there distributions catering to these or do I have to build them myself? I'd hate throw them away. They use so little power, have well designed hardware, and look nice.

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RE: X terminal distributions?
by Brian Densmore 03 Dec '04

03 Dec '04

Besides, fullsize CDs are cheaper than miniCDs. I like the miniCDs only for the coolness factor. Or is that geek factor? > -----Original Message----- > From: Leo Mauler > > > I just wanted to mention that a lot of older CDROM > drives don't like miniCDs and business card sized CDs > (or at least don't seem to boot from them). So even > though DamnSmallLinux does fit on a miniCD, go ahead > and burn it on a full-sized CD for those older laptops > that still have CDs. >

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